COLUMBUS, Ohio -- Which former Ohio State football player best exemplifies what it means to be a Buckeye? That’s what we’ll spend the next week trying to figure out with the help of the Buckeye Talk Subtext subscribers. Over 150 people were considered but only 32 could make the official bracket as Stephen Means, Stefan Krajisnik and Andrew Gillis discuss some of the greatest players in history. But this isn’t about just being the best. It’s about telling the story of a program and who we can’t tell that story without. That continues with our final Elite 8 matchup featuring Chris Spielman and J.T. Barrett Thanks for listening to Buckeye Talk and sign up to get text messages from experts Stephen Means, Stefan Krajisnik and Andrew Gillis at 614-350-3315. Get the insider analysis, have your voice heard on the Buckeye Talk podcast and connect with the best Buckeye community out there. Read the automated transcript of today’s podcast below. Because it’s a computer-generated transcript, it may contain errors and misspellings. Stephen Means (00:12.337) Welcome back to Buckeye Talk. I’m Stephen Means, that’s Tiffon Kreisler, that’s Andrew Gillis. We continue to work through our greatest Buckeye bracket. We’ve made it to the Elite Eight and we’ve made it to the final matchup of the Elite Eight. It’s the four or five game. It’s a game that’s always supposed to be competitive, always supposed to go wire to wire, maybe even in overtime. We’ll see what happens. Here’s the Irvin Meyer Regional Championship game, the number four seed Chris Spielman, linebacker from 1984 to 1987 and quarterback JT Barrett. quarterback from 2013 through 2017. Okay, so Stefan, there’s always, it feels like with all these conversations so far, when we’re talking about the accolades and stats, it’s a lot of, hey, would you rather want your stats to look like this? Or would you rather have your accolades and stats look like that? It’s like both of these meals are good, but are you in the mood for Mexican food or Mediterranean food? Do you want McDonald’s or do you want Wendy’s? Do you want Arby’s or do you want Taco Bell? If we’re at Penn State, and they’re right next to each other at a hotel we’re all staying at, you two want Taco Bell and I want Arby’s. I wonder which one we’re going to pick today. With Chris Spielman, I feel like it’s more about dominance. While with JT Barrett, it’s maybe more about longevity. Stefan Krajisnik (01:38.979) Yeah, no doubt. Cause you go up and down the board here of their accolades there. There’s a ton, right? There’s a, there’s a lot of time. I mean, with JT, you’re talking, uh, three time all big 10, big 10 freshmen of the year in 2014, three time big 10 quarterback of the year, 2016 big 10 most valuable player. And he was only an all American once. I’m reading this correctly out 2014, he was a third team, all American. was the only time he was an all American. And then when you look at Chris, Chris Spielman, you know, Again, three time first team all big 10 chick Harley award Lombardi award. He was a three time all American. So yeah, both were obviously very good. Spelling probably kind of over the scope of national success once and more with the all American accolades, but there’s no denying that both these guys are extremely decorated players. JT did it for, you know, a long time. He seemed like he was at Ohio state for forever, which now looks like nothing. Now, now it’s like, if you haven’t played nine years of college football, what are you doing? Which would have been hilarious because if JT Barrett played, maybe he would have found a way to get a few more years of eligibility under his belt. But yeah, JT, you know, from, from the time he arrived as a freshman was obviously Uber talented and, Uber successful throughout his career. but Spielman, when he played, he was, you know, among the most dominant linebackers in the country year after year. So it’s, it’s pretty impressive what both these guys were able to do kind of over the scope of their entire careers. Stephen Means (03:03.213) Andrews, if fair to call Chris Spielman James Zoronitis before James Zoronitis. Andrew Gillis (03:09.942) Ooh, that’s a good question. Maybe, the more that I think about it, maybe. I don’t hate that. I don’t hate that. That’s not a bad comp. Stephen Means (03:29.321) And both were the Stefan Krajisnik (03:29.878) It was him, then Katz and Moyer, then Laura Nidus and AJ Hawk. Stephen Means (03:35.077) And now you have our Vauris. All roads for Ohio State. Stefan Krajisnik (03:38.186) All roads lead to Glenville. Andrew Gillis (03:40.014) or how you should you should do one of those like things that like, like if you cover like a professional team or whatever you see those things like trade trees, you should just do that say, here’s how Chris Spielman led to Ohio State getting our vel Reese and go Chris Spielman was here, which made AJ Hawk come here, which made James Lauren itis come here, which made James Lauren itis be the linebackers coach and he and he’s gonna turn our vel Reese and got our vel Reese. And he’s going to be the greatest linebacker in the history of football. So you should do that. That should be your off season project. Stephen Means (04:16.913) I have a lot of off season projects already going on right now. I don’t know if I can add any more. Well, I’m just saying. Andrew Gillis (04:21.022) I was telling Stefan that. Stefan Krajisnik (04:24.962) I just got, I actually, we actually just had a reader email me another fun off season project that would, it would take so much time to do this. Great idea. A Buckeye route Mount Rushmore, but of all sports. We’d be here forever. Because like you got like this like now we’re talking Jack Nicklaus like this is a whole nother realm. Stephen Means (04:41.799) Stephen Means (04:48.837) Ohio State’s actually really good at sports. Stefan Krajisnik (04:51.49) It’s a look like sports are like arguably the best in the country. You know, like the SEC has a ton of great track and field programs and gold medalists and things like that. But like, I mean, Ohio State is pretty stacked too. Stephen Means (04:55.544) Stephen Means (05:03.761) Sure, the SEC does have a lot of great Olympians, and Ohio State has Jesse Owens. Andrew Gillis (05:04.044) Archie Griffin, Jesse Owens, Jack Nicklaus, and then a fourth. Yeah, yeah. One of the most consequential athletes in the history of the country. Yeah. Stefan Krajisnik (05:11.831) Stephen Means (05:16.129) He told Hitler, you know what? So like, I mean. Andrew Gillis (05:19.724) Yeah. The first person to win four gold, one four gold medals in a single Olympics. mean, like, all due respect to Troy Smith and Chris Spielman and like JT Barrett, like my bad, but like Jesse Owens, he’s he’s he’s just different. It’s it’s a different conversation. Stephen Means (05:37.553) Ohio State, obviously football is king and they get a lot of the the the viewership and conversation in the media. Ohio State University’s athletic department is very, very good at a lot like the the standard of beat Michigan, win the Big Ten, win national championships isn’t just for football. It’s most of it’s most of the 30 plus varsity sports on the campus. Stefan Krajisnik (06:05.666) What’s funny is now that we talk about it, actually think the real debate would just be the fourth, because I think between Owens, Nicholas, and Archie Griffin, three of the four Mount Rushmore’s might just be solidified. So maybe it’s not as tough of a project as I would have thought. Andrew Gillis (06:17.248) Exactly. We’re having heated debates. Stephen Means (06:17.701) Stephen Means (06:21.807) No, it’s not. And the fourth guy, you know the picture of like the three headed dragon they always put up and it’s like two serious ones and then one who looks kind of goofy. That would be the challenge is making sure that the fourth person doesn’t look like the goofy head because the other three, one might be the greatest golfer. Well, I mean, Tiger Woods has something to say about that, but you know, of his generation. Stefan Krajisnik (06:46.05) Yeah, but Jack’s got the most titles, most majors, so. Stephen Means (06:49.413) You know, it’s listen, he’s in the there’s Jack Nicholson, Jack, Jack Nicklaus, Michael Jordan, Tom Brady on one side of the table, LeBron James, Tiger Woods, Patrick Mahomes, the other side of the table in the one side of the table was like, this is what I did. Good luck. And the other side, like, don’t get too comfortable. Andrew Gillis (07:08.92) I mean, look, if. Andrew Gillis (07:16.897) It’s really funny because it’s like I was thinking about it and I was like, all right, so we got Owens and we got Nicholas and we got Archie and it’s like, all right, if LeBron had to go to college, that would have been a really easy Mount Rushmore to figure out because then we would have just thrown him on there and it would have been fine. Stephen Means (07:31.857) I hate that conversation because listen he didn’t send either one of his kids to Ohio State Andrew Gillis (07:37.088) Nobody has a degree from here. Stefan Krajisnik (07:39.682) That is true. That is true. Actor fiction. Actor fiction. LeBron is a doctor of public service, according to Ohio State. Stephen Means (07:50.033) So anyway, back to the linebacker discussion. I think the cool thing about that lineage though, that we just jokingly talked about, James Zorinaitis is the only one who’s not from Ohio. All the other ones are Ohio born and bred. and Chris Spielman in a lot of ways is the originator of that, which why I he was James Zorinaitis for James Zorinaitis. was the three time All-American. And listen, we’re gonna spend a lot of time praising Chris Spielman on this podcast. I just want you two to be prepared for that. Stefan Krajisnik (07:51.166) Andrew Gillis (07:51.278) Stephen Means (08:17.551) because we did not do him justice in the first couple of rounds here and we were showing our age and we have to be better at that. I said it yesterday. Our jobs are to hold other people accountable. We also means ourselves and we didn’t do a good job of celebrating Chris Spielman. So I’m just going to be popping in every soul and making sure that regardless of how we feel who should win this matchup, Chris Spielman is going to get celebrated on this pod. Not just as a football player, not just as an Ohio State ambassador, but as a human being for a decision he made to essentially end his career later on in his career. And that was during the NFL, but that deserves to be mentioned here as well. But from an accolade standpoint, that’s Spillman. Let’s take a quick break there. Stephen Means (09:08.069) What do we think of the JT Barrett era from just the talent standpoint, just as a football player, not the bigger picture or conversation, just from a simple fact of this guy was here for five years. He got an opportunity a year earlier than maybe people were expecting because of what happened to Braxton Miller to the saga of the 2015 season where they were going back and forth between him and Cardell Jones to 2016 where the quarterback play was Okay at best to ending his career with a big 10 championship in 2017 and I brought up the word Longevity and I do think that’s a nice way to put it But it’s also an honest way to put it He’s Ohio State’s all-time leader and passing yards and passing touchdowns, which means he threw a lot of yards and dupe a lot of touchdowns But it also can mean that he was for here forever in a day When a lot of the other guys who were up high on that list weren’t necessarily here forever Stefan Krajisnik (10:06.816) Yeah, it’s tough to kind of decipher it all because it is a lot of up and down, but the highs were so memorable. And I think it’s just one of those things where at that position, a lot of what you do is determined by your success. You talk about you guys like Tom Brady, like Patrick Mahomes. We don’t talk about them because of passing yards and passing touchdowns. We talk about them because of the games they won and the clutch moments that they’ve had and the postseason success that they’ve had. Stephen Means (10:29.169) Stefan Krajisnik (10:34.626) And as much as the JT era as impressive as some of the numbers are, you know, I’m is he through for more than 3000 yards in 2017, 2800 yards in 2014, 2500 yards in 2016. mean 2015 when he was when there was the whole saga going on, he still threw for 992 yards. Like the numbers are one thing, but it kind of goes in a team success too. I think that’s kind of what he’s remembered for more than anything is maybe the team success and how good Ohio State was. particularly in that stretch of his time at Ohio State, like I almost want to lump team success with accolades and stats as it pertains to JT because that’s so much of how he’s defined. It is the wins. Stefan Krajisnik (11:19.606) This like this the the four year I I mean he was there obviously five years like I kind of look more like a four year stretch for I mean. Stephen Means (11:19.707) Stephen Means (11:28.443) Yeah, that’s fair. Stefan Krajisnik (11:31.01) Like it’s one of the best stretches in college football history for a team that didn’t go back to back or things like that. You’re looking at 12 and two 14 to one 12 and one like they’re consistently in a national title conversation. It’s a pretty impressive run with him at the helm for most of Stephen Means (11:50.979) Andrew, I’m gonna hate. Andrew Gillis (11:54.456) think this is like the third time we’ve done one of these things where you go, Stefan, I’m gonna hate now. Or guys, I’m gonna hate. So go ahead, Steven, hate. Stephen Means (12:02.149) I tell you, Andrew Gillis (12:05.122) know, of course. These are some of the best Ohio State players in history. Stefan Krajisnik (12:06.529) At this point, Stephen Means (12:10.278) Stefan Krajisnik (12:10.57) Yeah, at this point in the quarterfinals slash elite a nitpicking is literally hating because we’re talking about a guy that would arguably be the best player at a lot of other programs. Andrew Gillis (12:16.302) Oh, 100%. Yeah. Stephen Means (12:17.041) Stephen Means (12:22.661) Before I get into my hate, one word answer. Who is more synonymous with Urban Meyer from a quarterback standpoint? JT Barrett or Tim Tebow? Stephen Means (12:37.733) And this is not just who was better because Tim Tebow won a Heisman, so I know that. But if you’re putting together a starting 22 of guys who are the essence of a head coach, which one would you choose? Andrew Gillis (12:37.902) Stefan Krajisnik (12:52.886) I think if you were to ask a neutral party observer, I think they would still say Tim Tebow. Andrew Gillis (12:55.712) I, I, that’s what I was trying to put myself in the mic. Cause I was like, I think sometimes you gotta be like, all right, what would a fan of Nebraska say about this? What would a neutral college football fan or somebody who’s kind of a removed from the Florida and Ohio state bubbles. And I think the answer is still Tim Tebow. Stephen Means (13:16.369) I think that is too, but I’m going to make the kiss with JT. And it’s part of my hate. Urban Meyer went 83 and nine and 54 and four as Ohio State’s head coach. rough, anyone seven and O against Michigan. Crazy. Nuts. Then he handed a Ferrari to Ryan Day and said, Hey, don’t crash it. I think the problem with that narrative is it’s not 100 % true. Andrew Gillis (13:19.672) Let’s hear it. Stephen Means (13:45.457) I don’t it was I think about two weeks ago when we did that pot when I had you guys like pull up the 2018 recruiting class and We were talking about how men on signing day We were talking about how we would have been talking about how elite this class is gonna be how amazing it’s going to be and then you look at it now that we’re at the end of the road you go man this class How was this class the number two class in the country? How are these guys rated as highly as they were? How was a class where? The only first round draft pick in a class that had like three or four or five star recruits is this three star guy who was a later dish later on edition. How does this class be the number two class in the country? This class kind of didn’t meet the bar. And I look at that class and I see a lot of what is missed when you go 83 and nine and 54 and four is you were so dominant, but you weren’t maximized. And that’s how I feel about the JT Barrett era of Ohio State football, especially when you add in the variables that Joe Burrow was his backup for two years and what Joe Burrow went on to be. Dwayne Haskins was his backup. And you see what Dwayne Haskins went on to be. And it’s like, man, that’s what was sitting behind this dude for three years here. The fact that he was in a battle with Cardale Jones in 2015, Cardale got drafted in JT Barrett. You see why I called it hate? Because this is really nitpicky. Stephen Means (15:13.969) 61 and 8 39 and 4 with JT Barrett on the roster and that does include the 2013 season step on if you want to take that out you take away the you know the 12 wins from the regular season and then obviously the losses in the Big Ten Championship game and also to Clemson in the Orange Bowl as well but still that’s a dominant the dominant stretch Orange Bowl loss in 2013 in 2014 even though he’s hurt Ohio State gets to National Championship game and wins that which includes a Sugar Bowl win over Alabama and the national championship win over Oregon. And it also means a 59 to nothing thumping of Wisconsin in the big 10 championship game, but he’s not the guy on the field in those important moments of the year. They won in the fiesta bowl the next year in 2015. And the reason they’re playing in the fiesta bowl is because they lost in Michigan state because the coaching staff completely mishandled that quarterback situation, how they deployed their weapons that year. Ezekiel Elliott just did not get the ball enough against Michigan state. They just mishandled things all year long and it finally came to bite them in the butt. So they don’t win the big 10. They don’t get to the college football playoff where I’m pretty sure most people thought they had the best chance of repeating. And so they end up. Blowing out Michigan and then get to the fiesta bowl and winning that game as well. The very next year they get back to the fiesta bowl. They backdoor their way into the college football playoff because they’re not the big 10 champs. Penn State’s the big 10 champs. Ironically enough, that’s the last time James Franklin beat Ohio State as well. They’re not the big 10 champs. They backdoor in and they get shut out by Clemson. Thus opening the window, opening the door to how Ryan Day came in here because it was like, hey, your quarterback plays not good enough. and your offense was essentially Curtis Sandler bust. That can’t happen again. They bring in Ryan Day, JT Baird has the best year of his career. They get to the cotton, but despite that, they still lose to Iowa and Oklahoma that year. That’s the year that Baker Mayfield plants the flag at Ohio Stadium. Thus beginning a saga that eventually ends with Jack Sawyer ready to fight the entire Michigan team six years later. And the government getting involved. Stephen Means (17:19.345) And putting out like the government’s getting involved in house. They football way too much right now. Everybody chill out. Okay. Everybody chill out. So I go to the cotton ball against USC. They win that game. That’s sending off JT bear as a three time big 10 champ. He is the big 10 freshman of the year in 2014, three time big 10 quarterback of the year. He’s the big 10 MVP silver football award winner in 2016, which is coming. I thought Curtis Samuel probably should have gotten that in 2016, but that’s another example of how things become quarterback awards. As you mentioned, Stefan. He was 13 all American in 2014 and he won the Kelly Moore award in 2017. It’s just, but it’s when you run that down, Andrew, when you just hear 61, eight and 39 and four, you think, man, this dude just like ran through everybody. But then when you add in the context and break it down season by season, for me, the urban Meyer era, the further we get away from it is it was awesome, but it wasn’t as good as it probably should have. And I feel like that’s what the JT Barrett era of Ohio State is. Andrew Gillis (18:21.452) I think that’s fair. I think you like, I think the, the weirder thing is like, you probably look at the 2015 team as the team where maybe like that team had a real big chance to go back to back, just considering how much talent they returned from 2014. you lose one game. and then you smack around Michigan and Notre Dame in the following two games right after that, like they were one of the best four teams in the country and they just didn’t get a chance to do that. Stephen Means (18:37.605) Andrew Gillis (18:51.478) So I think there’s definitely something there to say, like there were teams and maybe there were at teams and specifically that left something on the table. That was also the year that JT didn’t really play a lot. Like that was the year that they were, they had the quarterback situation that things were going back and forth. So it’s kind of like, you know, I know, like I believe Steve, don’t have to help me out here. Like I believe that game, like Zeke, he only got the ball a handful of times, but I think he had like the flu or something. Like it was a whole bunch of stuff going on. Stephen Means (19:16.389) Like 13 times. Andrew Gillis (19:22.798) So yeah, I think when you look at that era, and especially for how talented they were and how long Meyer was around and how good those teams were and what JT had, I don’t think it’s crazy to suggest that there was something left on the table and there was a little bit more that you could have garnered. Stephen Means (19:44.761) Now, I’ll step on the same, you can say the same thing about Chris Spielman and his time, though the difference is I don’t think at any point from 1984 to 1987, people went maybe that Chris Spielman’s part of the problem. And that was the case with JT like Earl Bruce, nine and three Earl, literally went nine and three the first three years that Chris Spielman was here and then they really fell off a cliff and that’s what got Earl Bruce fired ultimately. The 34, 13 and one. during Chris Fieldman’s time here, 23 and 10 in the big 10. Two big 10 championships, lost in the Rose Bowl, got a Citrus Bowl win, a Cotton Bowl win as well, and then didn’t make a bowl game his last year here. But I do, it’s, Chris Spielman’s more like CJ Strout in sense that, guys, this is not the reason why Ohio State’s not winning these games. Let’s make that abundantly clear. Chris Spielman did his part, and I’m sure when we get to some of these memorable moments and we get into the Michigan stuff, we’re gonna bring up that. Like, Chris Spielman did all he could do for four years. So, Ohio State going nine and three, nine and three, nine and three, and then I think like six and four his last year. is not on Chris Spielman at all. And so I think that’s the difference here and why I wanna get, I would give the edge to Spielman because in both situations, both played in eras where there was probably a lot of food still left on the bone. but I don’t think Chris Spielman is the reason food was still left on the bone with Ohio State in the eighties. While JT Barrett, I think it got to a point that by the end of it, people were thinking there’s gotta be more out there from a quarterback play standpoint for us to get to other than just what we’re getting. Andrew Gillis (21:35.358) Just to jump in real quick. So I think this is what you’re getting at, but is it I think what you’re saying is, is it fair to say team success should be weighted more heavily for JT than for Chris just because of the position that he played? And like when you look at how you weight these guys, his careers, it’s like, hey, Chris Spielman had 29 tackles when we’ll get to that, I’m sure when they lost to Michigan, like. They’re losing to Michigan. That game was not his fault. It was not here. It was not his his problem that they lost Michigan. I think you could make the argument that you know, hey, that’s more on the quarterback. That’s more on you know whoever, but. Is that is that kind of point you’re making? Stephen Means (22:14.449) But it’s I don’t but yes, but it’s not currently Yes, but I want to tweak it look because it’s not about the fact that one’s a quarterback and one’s a linebacker because if they were flipped and Chris Spielman was the quarterback in JT if Chris Spielman was as good of a quarterback as he is a linebacker and JT bear is as good of a linebacker as he is the quarterback. I would still say Chris Spielman is not the reason why Ohio State went 9 and 3 9 and 3 10 and 3 6 and 4 more while JT Barrett was part of why those Ohio State football teams, not a lot of losses, by the way, not a lot of losses, but loud losses that ended up being very, very consequential. Like losing the Michigan State in 2015 is possibly the difference between playing in a New Year’s six bowl looking on the outside, looking in at the college football playoff. versus Ohio State won the first two college football playoff national championships. Losing to Iowa, because I don’t think the Oklahoma loss alone would have left them out of the playoff, because they’d still be undefeated in the conference. They just had a non-conference loss. They’d probably make the playoff in 2017 if they don’t have that very, very bad loss to Iowa. And they backdoored in in 2016, but he was not the driver. of that offense. Curtis Samuel was the driver of that offense. So it’s less about their positions and more about the roles they played in winning and losing. It’s a little bit more of a conversation with JT Barrett than it is with Chris Spielberg. Stefan Krajisnik (24:01.6) Yeah, I mean, I agree, but the team success stuff still feels like it goes pretty heavily in Jay-Z’s favor. Stephen Means (24:10.437) Would you say he’s the number one reason why? Stefan Krajisnik (24:17.173) Probably not. mean he’s a big reason why I don’t know if I’d say he’s number one reason why Stephen Means (24:20.038) Stephen Means (24:23.601) Give it to JT then fine. mean again. Yes 6.8 61 and they are still sexy one day regardless of how you want to spin it. I just Stefan Krajisnik (24:30.144) I’m fine given individual accolades and success. Yeah, that’s definitely Chris. I mean. Stephen Means (24:34.385) Well, that’s not even close. That’s that’s Spillman. Yeah, that’s that’s Bill Spill, arguably the best defensive player in the country for 43. Yeah. Yeah, and that’s why. Stefan Krajisnik (24:41.844) I was going to say if you have if you have 205 tackles in a season, why don’t we just go ahead and let’s just go ahead and do that, which I think one thing you hit on earlier though, like or at least you were kind of hinting at. Chris Spielman being the number four seed despite. Pretty consistently going nine and three is really impressive that tells you how good of a player he is and how much when we get into the Buckeye or a category of this, like how much he means, because. I don’t like. Jack sword is not in this conversation if they go nine and three every year. You know, like there’s a lot of guys on this list where if they go nine and three every year, we’re not even like, we’re not even considering them. And yet Spielman’s the number four seed in the bracket. Stephen Means (25:13.377) Stephen Means (25:28.049) Speelman is why it wasn’t worse than I. Stephen Means (25:35.161) Wow, I feel like with Barrett. Stephen Means (25:40.527) I give him more credits for the losses than I do the wins and the sum of these and maybe that’s not fair. And that’s why I called it hate. Okay, let’s take a break. 614353315 that’s accolades and stats and team success. And now we start to get into the memorable moments. Plus us continuing to make sure that we give Spielman all the proper praise he deserves because even though we are young millennials, we are not going to show our age on this pod ever like that again. And that’s not true. We’re going to do it again, but not in that way in a more funny way. We’ll get more to that when we come back from the break here on Buckeye Talk. And we’re back here on Buckeye Talk. Stephen Means, Tiffan Kreisnik, and Andrew Gillis as we continue to run through our greatest Buckeye bracket. We’re talking Chris Spielman as the four seed against JT Baird as the five seed. Memorable moments from the seven to four. Spielman would be my pick. 29 tackles against the team. The team up north in his final game, that’s not actually what they said. That’s not the acronym they use, but that’s the one we’re going to stick with. Now drafts Buckeyes for the Lions behind enemy lines. That’s, that’s true. He works for the Lions and they just drafted Tylee Williams with the first pick first with their first round pick this year. He was also there when they drafted Jeff Okuda with the number three pick a couple of years ago. So that’s true. He is drafting some, not only Buckeyes, but he does draft Buckeyes. Stephen Means (27:03.761) Forgot to include the number on this one. I apologize for this one, Chris Bielmann arrived at Ohio State with some aura Thanks to appearing actually know I’m gonna save that one I’m gonna save that one because it helps make a point from the 205 It’s gotta be JT Barrett four-time Big Ten champ national champ for no against the team of North only WTF loss in four years only one what WTF loss in four years finally learning how to throw in 2017 under Ryan Day shows some toughness leadership work ethic and personal standards of excellence of being the but The Buckeye, only embarrassing thing he did was block. TND I don’t I don’t know but JT Barrett is the forever block we we have not seen an Ohio State quarterback get the block yet But if that award existed, I think JT Barrett would have gotten it in 2017. And the number one reason why is he is the first player in Ohio State history to ever be a three-time captain. Tuff Borland would eventually do that as well. But three-time captain, I think it starts there because that’s about more than just being a good football player. That is for three straight years. Everybody in that locker room looked at you and said, you’re a Stefan Krajisnik (28:20.074) And at a place like Ohio State that matters more than a lot of other places. I think you’re 100 % right. mean, there’s no doubt in my mind he would have been a blocko. Stephen Means (28:33.201) 100 years from now when the NCAA allows players to wear double zero The Block O award is for Bill Willis. The Double O, the Double Block is going to be, the Block O is going to be for JT Barrett. Andrew Gillis (28:47.852) The block ooh. Stephen Means (28:53.936) And it’s going to re- Stefan Krajisnik (28:54.528) We can award an honorary Block O. Stephen Means (28:59.065) Yeah, what if they start doing it for both sides of the ball? Stephen Means (29:05.603) Well, no, it’s going to be a double butt for his butt and it’s going and every year the award is going to have Jim Harbaugh doing the JT with short mean richer. I think that’s a memorable moment for JT Barrett. No. Stefan Krajisnik (29:19.042) 100%. I actually like, don’t think we’ve brought it up and talking about JT yet. Like that might be for better or for worse, his most memorable moment. Stephen Means (29:28.815) Yes, having a big butt. And so he wasn’t short. That’s a weird thing to say, but it’s true. Stefan Krajisnik (29:37.9) True. Yeah, when I was going through kind of best moments and doing some research and trying to figure out like which ones deserve to be in this conversation, I got to a point where I was just like, this has to be part of the conversation. Stephen Means (29:50.189) After you say, hey, he’s the first ever three time captain, go, Jim Harbaugh would have had him win over Ohio State five years earlier if it weren’t for JT. Stefan Krajisnik (30:00.758) And what’s funny too is like when you hear the name, like everyone calls it JT was short or at least online. That’s what everyone calls it. You would think automatically like that’s a bad moment in Ohio state history. It’s like, no, no. JT wasn’t short, but they thought he was short. So now it’s called JT was short. Stephen Means (30:19.087) Is JT’s butt the number one thing on your list, Andrew? And I know I asked it like that. I know what I did. Stefan Krajisnik (30:24.022) Andrew Gillis (30:27.264) It wasn’t. Yeah, JT’s butt was not number one on my list, believe it or not. Stephen Means (30:32.593) It’s not number one in your heart. What’s number one are you listening if it’s not the butt Andrew Gillis (30:40.75) well, in terms of like moments for JT, the one that I first thought of was 39 38 versus Penn State. And I get it wasn’t against Michigan, but like, go back and look at the highlights of that game. A team does not win that game without JT Barrett. And that was one of the better football games that I can remember watching. And it was like, for a lot of these guys, you like, you have to look up, it’s like, Like spoiler alert for Chris Spielman. I’m like, let me look up the 29 tackles game. Let me. And you’re kind of like going through all the archives. You’re doing all this stuff with JT Barrett. was like memorable moments. yeah, I remember that game. I remember watching that game with a bunch of Ohio State fans and one Penn State fan who had a great first half and was not well by the end of the game. And I like there were moments of that game where like Gus Johnson was doing and whether you like him or not. he was right to freak out because he was like, oh, what a throw. Because like there were throws that JT made where he was getting drilled and he would just find somebody open. And like, it’s important to remember this was 2017. This was not F at Jeremiah down there somewhere. This was not, hey, we have 17 first round picks on this roster. They had really great receivers on that team. Like Terry McCormick was on that team. Stephen Means (31:43.153) That was Pete, Gus Johnson. Stephen Means (32:08.047) Yeah, we do, Andrew Gillis (32:08.958) Like they had great receiver, but it was not at the level that it is today. I think that is important to give him kind of a kind of props for. So that was the moment that I thought of, because like I thought about that team and that game. And I just went, man, like there were a lot of Ohio State moments over his career that. You know, they were great, but that to me was the game that just was like. He is making plays that it’s the laziest narrative we have in sports media and in sports fandom, but he was just a gamer. And he was just a, like, he was just a gamer when it came time to it, man. He was just a winner. And like, Ohio State was losing that entire game from literally the first play, not the first play from scrimmage, the first play when Saquon ran the kickback. And somehow they were down by 15 points with like six minutes left and JT found a way to win that game. That was, mean, that to me is the game that I think maybe epitomizes what JT Barrett was and who JT Barrett was as Ohio State starting quarter. Stephen Means (33:15.761) Joe Thomas Bear the fourth. Who says I can’t win the big game? That was Pete Gus Johnson. That I think the best two games of Ohio State that Gus Johnson has ever called is 39 and 38 over Penn State in 2017 and 59 to nothing over Wisconsin in 2014. When every time Cardell Jones to a deep shot. Wow. Andrew Gillis (33:20.965) Stephen Means (33:44.177) Cardale Jones, Cardale Jones, the whole world’s looking at Cardale Jones. That’s Pete. That’s just that’s LeBron against Boston in 2012. Man, it’s just a chef kiss. The thing about that Penn State game for one, 17 straight completions to close out the game. That was an Ohio State record that Kyle McCord later broke, but it took him two games. That was over two games that Kyle McCord broke that record in twenty twenty three. C.J. Stroud tied it in the Michigan State game. I think he either tighter or came one short of it in the Michigan State game in 2021, but 17 straight completions to close out that game. Interesting thing is that’s the, think this is the most efficient stretch of JT Barrett’s career. These two games against Nebraska and against Penn State, they beat Nebraska 56 to 14 the week before that where he was 27 of 33 for 325 yards and five touchdowns. So across two games, 60 of 72, that’s 83.3 completion percentage. for 653 yards and nine touchdowns. He also added 27 carries for 143 yards and two touchdowns. In those two games, no sacks. Well, no, he was stacked. He didn’t actually sack anybody, but he didn’t have a tackle in the Penn State game. That’s an interesting fact too. But yeah, I think that’s it because it, you gotta remember earlier that year, Oklahoma had come to town and they lose that game 31 to 16 and he’s only 19 of 35, 483 yards and he throws in an interception. So that was kind of a thing with JT Baird is that like, he doesn’t show up when you need him to show up. He shows up when there’s a clear. Talent gap and he hadn’t had that moment because again in 2014. He didn’t do it against Virginia Tech. He did do it against Penn State. He got a moment in that game too, where he led a double overtime went over Penn State, but he just hadn’t had a lot of those moments because he was not the quarterback for the College football playoff run in 2014 and then in 2016 they just weren’t really all that great offensively. They kind of backboard the way in 15 things are so weird. So this was kind of. Stephen Means (35:47.481) JT Barrett staple moment, Stefan. Here comes some more hate, Here’s the problem. He had the best two game stretch. I think of his career from an efficiency standpoint against the brassica and Penn State. But if somebody were to come down from space and ask me to describe what two games I should watch that best describes the JT Barrett, Ohio State fan experience. It’s Penn State and Iowa because he did that. And then seven days later, He throws the pick six on his first play against Iowa and he finishes the day 18 of 34 with three touchdown passes and four interceptions. Like that paired together is JT Barrett at his ultimate high and his ultimate low. Stefan Krajisnik (36:41.442) The joke joke I was going to make was JT Barrett was part of the only time right or James Franklin has beaten Ohio State. He’s also the reason James Franklin has never won two straight games against Ohio State. Stephen Means (36:53.873) It was funny is every Ohio State Penn State game since 2017 has played out just like that You get to the end of the first half. You’re like, okay Penn State might win this game. They get you then you’re like, oh no, never mind. That’s and over time you just see it enough that you stop believing in it you get Dwayne Haskins doing it the very next year at Penn State you get Justin Fields doing it for two years TJ Stroud doing it you get what JT did in 2022 even this year Will Howard just threw a pick six on his first throw. Will Howard fumbled out the back of the end zone. Penn State’s at the goal line. Stefan Krajisnik (37:33.634) I literally- Andrew Gillis (37:34.796) Yeah, and that will the 2017 game was like the one where it was just like that was like kind of the start of it because like you mentioned it. Well, wasn’t that one was the meanest one for Penn State’s fans because like, hey, holy snot, we just got to pick six and we’re we was 10 nothing and Ohio State’s had three plays and my God, we’re at home and my God, blah, blah, blah. And it’s like every kind of game was like you play that and then like the first kind of couple of drives go by and then you get into the second half and it’s like. Stephen Means (37:41.873) It was the start of Winfaith teasing its fan base that it actually could be wild 3 to 10. Andrew Gillis (38:04.754) I was winning that game by 15 points with five minutes. Like they were they were winning that game by a lot or whatever it was. They were winning that game by multiple scores in the fourth quarter and they found a way to lose. And then every every time since. So it’s like that was like, yeah, that was the start of it. That was and that was like, frankly, like if that happened in twenty twenty four, like if you flip the twenty twenty four game and the twenty seventeen game where it’s like, man, like. Stefan Krajisnik (38:18.306) It started the curse. Andrew Gillis (38:31.48) J you know, Penn State came into Ohio Stadium and they got a pick six early and then, you know, Ohio State’s front seven just stopped Saquon Barkley, which they did that day. But like, they just, didn’t do anything. Saquon didn’t do anything. If that happened in 2024, we’d be like, they’re never going to beat him again. What, this is impossible. They were doing this and it’s never going to happen. Stephen Means (38:51.089) I I feel that way now. I they’re not. I might I’m a I might rank Penn State number one, people. I mean, I think they’re going be the Ohio State. I might. It’s early. The Bay people doesn’t come out until August. I’m not like that’s not something I’m it’s in the back of my mind right now. But I just think this Penn State and at Iowa for me, Stefan, that is JT Barrett in a nutshell. When it’s good. Andrew Gillis (39:02.626) Breaking news on Buckethead. Stephen Means (39:21.581) It creates these moments. When it’s bad, it creates these moments. And it’s why I feel like he left here with a love-hate relationship with the fan base. Stefan Krajisnik (39:34.082) Yep, not every memorable moment has to be a good one. It just has to be memorable. Stephen Means (39:37.933) to be memorable. That’s it. Andrew Gillis (39:41.004) Well, and the other part of this, Stefan Krajisnik (39:41.858) Will Howard sliding against Oregon is technically memorable. Stephen Means (39:45.572) Andrew Gillis (39:45.8) Yeah. And like the thing that I was gonna say was like, yeah, hey, look, JT Barrett was the reason that Ohio State beat Penn State. Stephen Means (39:58.821) He’s also the reason they lost out. Andrew Gillis (40:00.898) They also got thumped by Iowa the next week. And like, was one of those things where it was like that. I remember there was like a brief conversation that year of like, man, Ohio State should, you know, and the big 10 should look out for their teams better because it was like both Ohio State and Penn State lost the following week after just that war and Ohio, but Ohio State went to Iowa and got destroyed. And I remember that like JT was not good at all in that game. And, you know, that was one, like I think there was a lot more, a lot more give and take. And I think that that, especially, I think time might be good to JT Barrett. Like I think if we did this poll in 2019, I don’t know if he’s as high because I think people, like you said, Steven, we’re just kind of ready for a change and ready for a higher ceiling player. But there were good and bad moments. And I think that was kind of a good encapsulation of it was. They had a great moment against Penn State and then the following week they lose by 31 points to Iowa. Stephen Means (41:02.875) Hold on to that thought. Because I don’t think I don’t agree, but I don’t think I agree either. I’m gonna make a point about. Andrew Gillis (41:12.982) What? Okay. Stephen Means (41:14.225) I’ll explain later. Meanwhile, on the other side of things, 29 times. Stephen Means (41:21.969) What do you want to do with it? Stefan, he tied Tom Cousin now for the most tackles in a single game on Ohio State football player against Michigan in 1986. They also lost to Michigan in 1986, 26 to 24. And we have spent time going, talking about the fact that Jack Sawyer had an immaculate interception in his Michigan loss, final Michigan loss, but they lost the game. So who cares? Do we have to apply the same logic? to Chris Spielman. Stefan Krajisnik (41:54.595) I think so. That’s what I struggle with. You know, the Jack Sawyer thing, maybe it’s a little bit different because he also never beat Michigan. So he doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt of, you you played well, but it was in a loss. It gets okay. Cause he doesn’t have the wins to make it okay. He doesn’t have the wins to make a loss in which he played well. Okay. So maybe Spillman gets a little bit more benefit of the doubt than Jack did, but I struggle with it. I struggle with it because I’m not I’m not sure How much that’s I guess celebrated when it came in a loss. It’s sure we can say it’s memorable. We just did it with the JT Iowa game. It’s memorable if you were there or if you were listening on the radio, whatever it may have been. You remember 29 tackles against Michigan. But that might be all you try to remember from that game, if any. Stephen Means (42:54.075) The other one that pointed out to me, I’m saving Wheaties box stuff right now. The other one that stands out to me is before the cotton ball in his final bowl game, he goes and he visits the hospital. He goes and visits an energy high school player at a hospital and he promised him he’d have an interception in the game. And then he went and had an interception again. Those are, whenever you say you’re going to go do something and then you go do it, especially something that’s that’s interceptions don’t always just kind of happen. There’s no, there’s not a lot of skill. Yes. Yes. And. Interceptions are like 50 % more like 40 % skills, 60 % just being in the right place at the right time. And so for those two things that come together and you paired with the day before he said, yeah, I’m going to go do this thing. And he went and did it. That’s memorable for me, but you called your shot. Calling your shot is always okay with me. No problem. Calling your shot. Stefan Krajisnik (43:24.524) Well, it was a PIG 6.2, right? Yeah. Stephen Means (43:53.359) Anything else? Any other moments for Crispy Omen? Stefan Krajisnik (43:59.383) He can have holes. Andrew Gillis (43:59.438) I came with the 29 tackles one though. Stefan Krajisnik (44:04.182) I was gonna say, he kinda does fall into this category too of like, he was just so consistent over his career. Stephen Means (44:10.191) Average like 15 tackles a game. Stefan Krajisnik (44:11.732) Right. Like R. Q. Griffin’s the one seed. I don’t know if he has a memorable moment per se, because he was just so consistent. think Spielman kind of falls into that conversation. That’s how you kind of become an all time great is you don’t have, know, if you’re, if you’re consistent is how you become one of the best linebackers in college football history, right? It’s not having a 29 tackle game and then not showing up the rest of the season. like it’s also like for linebackers, I think hard, like we even struggled with AJ Hawk to come up with like a memorable moment per se, just because of the position itself. So. Andrew Gillis (44:36.002) Stefan Krajisnik (44:42.818) I think what he maybe lacks in memorable moments is why he maybe makes it up in accolades and stats because he did it every week. It’s same logic applies that I mentioned on the last podcast. If you’re someone who goes to a game once a year, you probably saw a good Chris Spielman game and you remember it. Stephen Means (45:02.897) So here’s Michigan success. Chris Bielman goes two and two. They went in 1984, 21 and six. He gets a Michigan team that went six and six. They lose 27 to 17 in 1985 and get to Michigan team that’s 10, one and one. They lose to a Michigan team that was 11 and two, 26 to 24 in 1986. And then they beat a Michigan team that finished eight and four, 23 to 20 in 1987. Here’s JT Bear. Stephen Means (45:39.237) 2013 They win 42 to 41 against a Michigan team. That’s 76 in 2014 they win 42 to 28 against a Michigan team. That’s five and seven and then this is where it gets fun because now they start playing some decent Michigan teams urban Meyer played a lot of bad Michigan teams during his time here, but he also played a couple good ones in 2015 they won 42 to 13 against a Michigan team that was 10 and 3 and again, Ohio State’s ticked off because they had just lost to Michigan State and ruin their chances of getting back into the college football playoff race. So that, that does matter there. In 2016, memorable game, 30 to 27 and double overtime against a 10 and three Michigan team. I think that was a two, three matchup, if I’m not mistaken. So that, that’s a big deal. And then in 2017 in Ann Arbor, they win 31 to 20 against a Michigan team that is eight and five. but I didn’t include that one fully. I gave him a half point for that one because he didn’t finish that game because again, another memorable moment that says much about a guy who didn’t make the bracket as it is about JT Barrett. JT got hurt in warmups because of a cameraman. And so Dwayne Haskins had to come into the game. Thus beginning the Dwayne ask Haskins on field story. Dwayne finishes that game, has a really good game. And then there’s like conversations about it. JT Barrett going to be healthy enough to play in the big 10 championship game. The following week, Dwayne Haskins was taking all the reps with the ones during the week. Then they come to find out JT can play and they go on to win the big 10 championship. So I gave JT a half a point for the final Michigan game. So I made him four and a half and more. you know, against Michigan. Well, Chris Spielman is two and two. How much Michigan credit can we give either one of them though? And the reason why I’m asking it with these two specifically is I brought the records in as you noticed with what they did against Michigan. And this is not blaming Chris Spielman. This is just a team he’s played on. They beat Michigan when Michigan was bad and they lost to Michigan when Michigan was good. Stephen Means (47:57.743) while at least with JT Barrett, good, bad, and different, they beat Michigan. Stefan Krajisnik (48:06.422) Yeah, mean, JT was part of one of the most dominant stretches, if not the most dominant stretch in this rivalry’s history. And I think that matters. Andrew Gillis (48:18.572) Yeah, I’m with Stefan. Like being being like we talk about it’s like the moments that it happens in, right? Like it’s not just like, you know, X, X, Y, did you win binary one or zero? Yes or no. It’s like, well, there’s also some context here and like being part of that stretch, especially for like, especially that game in 16, like that that has to matter, I think. just for the way that some of those games happen and the teams that Michigan had. Stephen Means (48:52.273) Andrew Gillis (48:53.751) Yeah, I think so. Stephen Means (48:55.409) Tyler in Toronto, four year starter at quarterback, three time big 10 quarterback of the year, big 10 player of the year, never lost to the team of North hoes, 25 plus, Ohio state records, countless big 10 records, including most touchdowns, most touchdown passes, most career yards and led a team through 11 and a half games of a national championship season. That’s a good way to put that heart, grit, toughness and leadership. He embodies everything that it means to be a Buckeye, the Penn State comeback in the shoe. and the Wolf Greys will live on forever. That’s true, they were wearing some alternate jerseys. Joe Thomas Baird IV, he’s not on a position Mount Rushmore, he’s not the best athlete, he’s not the most talented, he’s not even an NFL prospect from a school that all they do is produce NFL talent, but he has an argument for the greatest Buckeye. Let’s take a break and then I wanna elaborate more on that when we come back from the Break Your Own Buckeye Talk. And we’re back on Buckeye Talk, Stephen Means, Stefan Kreisling, Andrew Gillis, and Tyler Toronto, I think, hit JT Barrett on a nail for what his aura is. Ohio State just, they spit out NFL talent every year. It’s just kind of what they do. Andrew Gillis (49:54.798) Stephen Means (50:05.719) Andrew, you made a point earlier about the idea that maybe time goes by, JT gets higher on this list. Well, he’s he’s fifth right now. I don’t think I agree. It’s because of what Tyler Toronto said here at the end here. He’s not going to be on a position Mount Rushmore. He’s not the best athlete, not the most talented, not even NFL prospect from a school where all they do is produce NFL talent, but he has the argument for the greatest buck eye. Stephen Means (50:40.901) I don’t think he can get any higher than five given the four people who are ahead of him. But I also don’t think he’s going to drop any lower than five. Andrew Gillis (50:47.672) Stephen Means (50:54.775) Even though he is not going the further and further we get from JT Barrett, given the way Ryan days producing these quarterbacks right now, he is going to be arguably the worst quarterback Ryan days had during his time here. Right. It’s it’s from a sheer talent standpoint, it’s either him or Will Howard. And we’re just talking sheer NFL arm talent because I mean, the Wayne’s the first round draft pick. See Justin and CJ were first round draft picks. Julian sands a five-star recruit who might be in that lineage of first round draft picks when we get to the end of the coffin here Tavon Sinclair Looks the part of a dude who might be the number one pick in the NFL draft one day Brady Edmonds Looks the part for a guy who’s still 16 years old So we don’t know what’s going to happen here and there’s no reason to believe Ryan Day is not going to keep recruiting quarterbacks at a high level So there’s going to be plenty of more shot. I would Over under over the next 10 years, Ohio State has two and a half more first round picks at quarterback. I think given what’s happening right now, I might take the over. Andrew Gillis (52:03.468) What’s the timeframe? 10 years. Stephen Means (52:05.105) Stefan Krajisnik (52:06.848) I’d probably take the over. I think you left off one name that I think some people would say he was worse than JT, which is Kyle McCord. But in terms of recruiting and talent, like if we’re talking to sheer talent. Andrew Gillis (52:19.51) Like arm talent Kyle McCord was better than JT Marriott. And McCord got drafted. Stephen Means (52:20.997) McCord got drafted. Stefan Krajisnik (52:22.593) Stephen Means (52:25.49) There was, I think, and that’s the... Stefan Krajisnik (52:26.786) But if we’re sure there’s a there’s a talent debate, there’s also just like the how good were you like I don’t care about your ratings. I think a lot of people would probably say JT or Kyle McCord. Stephen Means (52:43.579) think JT has all the other components that are necessary. which is why I don’t think he is a better just sheer quarterback arm talent guy than Kyle McCord was. But there’s more to it than that. And that’s why we’re having conversations right now about, is Julian, you know, built like that? No one’s worried about him being able to throw the ball, but are you, you got dog in your man? Can you be a leader? Can you command the locker room? And You’d rather, in college especially, you’d probably rather have that than the other thing. Stefan Krajisnik (53:25.058) JT had a lot of that. Stephen Means (53:26.161) And JT, three time captain, man, regardless of how you feel about his arm talent and his overall just natural ability, wasn’t nobody questioning who was running things in that locker room. They were, yeah, he was in a quarterback battle for seven weeks into the season. And that once in that fall camp, the people go, I don’t know if JT’s our leader. No, no, this is JT’s team. Stefan Krajisnik (53:40.918) That’s called Aura. Andrew Gillis (53:40.962) Andrew Gillis (53:46.318) Stephen Means (53:54.629) regardless of who’s taking snaps right now. Andrew Gillis (53:54.798) did. It’s a little bit like if you guys have ever seen Rudy, where the coach looks at him and goes, I wish I could put my wish I could put your heart and body. Right. But it’s like he’s like, he looks at Rudy’s like, I wish I could put your heart and some of my body and like, it’s obviously disrespectful in some ways to JT because JT was not like some scrawny little walk on who was like kind of whiny and didn’t really deserve to be on the team. Yeah, he was like, JT was like a great player. But it’s like, he Stefan Krajisnik (54:02.85) If you guys have ever seen Rudy Stephen Means (54:05.007) No, I’ve never heard of this movie before. Stephen Means (54:17.297) It’s like a top 150 recruitment out of high school. Andrew Gillis (54:23.02) It’s like you look at some of the talented players and it’s like, man, what made them great was not what made JT great. And what made JT great was just something, frankly, I mean, Steven, you’ve you covered fields and Haskins and Stroud and McCord and Howard. And I think it’s fair to say that none of those guys, although I think you could say, well, CJ had the best blah, blah, blah. But Justin had the best blah, blah. And you could kind of go through like with physical talents. But I don’t know how many people you’re saying they were better as a leader and they were better as a captain and they were more impactful in the locker room than JT. Like JT had something that none of those guys, some of whom are like on NFL all pro trajectories. They didn’t have what JT had. Stephen Means (55:08.813) No, the only one who was even close to that was Will Howard. I’ll say this, though, but they had it. Even if it was not the level of JT, they had, that’s the thing. And especially here where you’re better than everybody every week, for the most part, you’re literally just going to be better than everybody else, which is why Ryan Day, when it comes to the quarterback play, you’re never, how often have you heard him go, you got to be able to make the throw when it’s time to make the throw. It’s make the routine plays routinely. You know, footwork. It’s like basic fundamental stuff. The way he talks about quarterback, but you want to know why? Just can’t have my cover. JJ can’t my cover. Marvin can’t have my cover. I’m back. I can’t have my cover. Jackson and Garrett and Chris and Carnell and Brandon in this. And now you got Max Clara. Can we cover these dudes? Man, are you serious? Somebody catching Trey on a breakaway run? No. We watch Quinchon dribble a man’s head on the ground and then walk into the end zone. You’re better than everybody else. That’s kind of the point here. It’s one of those schools where you’re just you’re literally just better than everybody else So you don’t have to always know when you have it’s time to be special when it’s time to do what you see J did against Georgia what Justin did against Clemson what Dwayne did against Penn State what JT Barrett did against Penn State or Will Howard did on this playoff right now Yes, the most sometimes when you get matchup games, you got to be able to you know, do it do but 85 % of your schedule, you’re just better than everybody else. So I don’t need you to be special. I don’t need you to be Superman this week, dude. I need you to get Superman the ball. You’re Alfred. Tell Superman and Batman and Wonder Woman and Flash and all, just tell them where to go. That’s your job, essentially, as Ohio State’s quarterback. You are Alfred. Stephen Means (57:04.443) So when that’s true, then the it, and we know what I’m saying when I say it, that has to be special. That has to be top notch. can’t not, like when you lose to Michigan, 13 to 10. You gotta have it, because you’re gonna have to pull this team out of the darkest place it’s been in in some time. And do you think, let’s run down the list of Ryan DeCortbacks. Do you think, we know Will Howard could do it, because he just did it. Do you think Kyle McCord would have been able to do that? Stefan Krajisnik (57:46.111) Andrew Gillis (57:46.146) Stephen Means (57:47.697) Do you think CJ Stroud would have been able to do that? Stefan Krajisnik (57:52.544) Andrew Gillis (57:53.078) I mean, you would know better, but yeah, probably. Yeah. Stephen Means (57:55.217) I mean, he did it. He did it. He literally did it. They lost the Georgia game because all their weapons were on the sideline or at a hospital. Yeah. Like they were going to the national championship thing. So he did it. Justin’s a harder one because I think COVID, we didn’t really get a chance to be around Justin the same way we got in the chance to be around the other quarterbacks and get to know him because I mean, entire second year with him was through a computer screen. Andrew Gillis (58:04.13) Yeah, that was not on him. Stephen Means (58:27.845) But he got knocked out of the Michigan game, came back in and threw a touchdown pass. He broke his ribs in the Clemson game, missed one play and came back and threw a touchdown pass. So I think he would have done it just based off what we’ve seen, his proofs in the pudding. And then JT knows zero doubt in my mind, zero doubt in my mind, JT Barrett could have pulled him out of that hole. Now, does it mean he would have been able to go execute football wise? That’s a different conversation, right? That’s football. But Having this team ready to play and moving on from that moment, there is only one quarterback we say right now from the Ryan Day time being here, whether as an assistant coach or as a head coach that we don’t think would have been able to do that. That is important. And it’s why he can’t, you just, that’s aura. That’s not about being a good football player. He can’t go any higher because I think the four people above him also have that type of aura. So you gotta start looking at other things. Stefan Krajisnik (59:24.396) Stephen Means (59:26.117) But I do not think there is a quarterback that Ryan Day can have who is going to have more aura than what JT Barrett has while also saying that he is going to have three more first round draft picks at quarterback. I think both of those things can be true. Stefan Krajisnik (59:45.11) The other guy was on a Wheaties box. Stephen Means (59:47.427) And the other guy was on a freakin’ Wheaties box, man! Stefan Krajisnik (59:50.207) as a high schooler. Andrew Gillis (59:52.046) Yeah, back when that was like cool. with all due respect, like it is cool. But like if Jeremiah Smith was on a Wheaties box today, is it as cool as it was in 1980? Stefan Krajisnik (59:55.306) I still think it’s pretty cool. I like- Stefan Krajisnik (01:00:01.942) I think it’d be pretty cool. Stephen Means (01:00:04.913) Yes. Have you guys seen the Thunderbolts yet? I don’t know anymore. There’s like a post credit scene where one of the superheroes is the Red Guardian is hype about the fact that he’s on the Wheaties box. And he’s like the entire, this is not spoiled. The movie’s been out for a month. The entire. Stefan Krajisnik (01:00:05.058) Probably not, probably. Stefan Krajisnik (01:00:18.786) There we go. Andrew Gillis (01:00:22.274) Stefan Krajisnik (01:00:22.914) I am a Marvel guy that wants to watch the movie. So let’s be careful with any spoilers. I just haven’t seen her yet. Stephen Means (01:00:27.941) no, no, no. It’s one of the it’s not a post. There’s two post credit scenes. One of them is actually important. I won’t spoil it for you. The other ones, it’s more of a fun. You know, thanks for sticking around. He’s in the grocery store standing next to his Wheaties box and a woman whose grocery shopping walks by and he’s like looking at her. Look at the Wheaties box trying to get her to put two and two together that I’m the guy on the Wheaties box. And it’s so funny because she puts the Wheaties box down when she goes around the corner because the weird guy just handed you a cereal box. I’m not holding onto this, but it’s yes, it’s still cool. Andrew being on the Wheaties box is never not going to be people still eat cereal. Stefan Kr